But it does. If I understand what you mean. It does offer the
opportunity to verify. That is what we teach our students to look for:
References, references, references at the bottom of all serious wp
articles. We actually use wp as an example when we try to teach
architecture students some information competence (if that phrase is
still allowed to use ...)
hm... maybe you meant that the authors/editors do not have to verify
before publishing an article? That is a weakness, one of many, but
still - I will defend this fantastic \'venture\' that - among other
things - helps protect and develop small and endagered languages, like
sami: http://se.wikipedia.org/wiki/Váldosiidu
Bye for now, I must go on with my \"knitting\", or rather: my wp
writing session, before bedtime.
Kjersti
Siterer Marlene Koenig <[log in to unmask]>:
> Oops that should read "Wikipedia does not offer the opportunity to verify,
> ..
>
>
>
> Marlene A. Koenig
>
> Librarian
>
> WAAC - Virginia Tech
>
> 1001 Prince Street
>
> Alexandria, VA 22314
>
> 703-706-3039 (phone)
>
> 703-549-0532 (fax)
>
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
>
> From: Margaret English [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 3:25 PM
> To: Marlene Koenig
> Cc: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>
>
>
> Marlene -- I don't see this as a "kerfuffle", but as an interesting
> discussion.
> Thanks!
>
> Margaret
>
> PS - I love that quote.
>
>
>
> On 1/19/2012 3:03 PM, Marlene Koenig wrote:
>
> My apologies for causing an obviously discordant note. The majority of my
> career as a professional librarian has been in the news business, as a news
> librarian, which may explain why I have a very different view than most
> librarians here. There are a lot of whiffs of inaccuracy about Wikipedia
> entries, and, I come from a background where you want to make sure the facts
> are accurate before going to print. Wikipedia does offer the opportunity
> to verify, verify, verify before hitting the load button!
>
>
>
> I have the following posted by my desk: "The trouble with quotes on the
> internet is that it's difficult to determine whether or not they are
> genuine. Abraham Lincoln." I have gotten a few perplexed looks . told
> one student: Lincoln tweeted this while waiting for the play to start at
> Ford's Theatre.
>
>
>
> I am really sorry for causing such a kerfuffle.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marlene A. Koenig
>
> Librarian
>
> WAAC - Virginia Tech
>
> 1001 Prince Street
>
> Alexandria, VA 22314
>
> 703-706-3039 (phone)
>
> 703-549-0532 (fax)
>
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
>
> From: ARLIS/NA List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Margaret
> English
> Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2012 2:04 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>
>
>
> This is an excellent observation, Cindy.
> I recall my frustrating job / volunteer search as a new Art History graduate
> student. I found that I was competing with "the horsey set", "wives of" and
> "ladies who lunch" for low-paying, entry-level gallery positions (usually
> with no benefits). Invariably, the competition didn't even need a salary -
> they just liked getting out of the Rosedale mansion for an afternoon, LOL.
>
> Cheers!
> Margaret
>
> On 1/19/2012 1:19 PM, Cindy Wolff wrote:
>
> A community where people share information is an endeavor that benefits so
> many people, but life-altering experiences shouldn't only go for people who
> can afford to work for free.
>
>
>
> This is an issue that surfaces from time to time that in order to secure
> that resume-enhancing internship or volunteering, it is increasingly
> becoming a hardship for those who need to work for food, rent, and clothing.
> Add the responsibility of taking care of family members, both young and old,
> on top of that, the profession runs the risk of creating a two-tier level of
> library professionals where at the top there are financially comfortable
> people getting all the good experience and later good jobs because they can
> afford to work for free, while others find meaningful careers out of their
> reach simply for needing a paycheck for their time, which is not limited to
> working in a library.
>
>
>
> Volunteers do a great service in support of institutions, but they should be
> an enhancement in the workforce, not a replacement, and I don't know if
> administrators care enough about the difference. Do either of those
> volunteers have a library or archival background? If not, we are sending a
> message that you don't need one for one of these great experiences, and many
> people have spent a lot of money on their degrees. Are we reverting back to
> an era where you have to be a "gentleman scholar" for career advancement?
> Not very one of those is an expert in the field.
>
>
>
> But with Wikipedia, anyone can claim expertise. I think Wikipedia has
> improved the culture by calling out many amateurs with an agenda, but they
> still exist and contribute, and we get what we pay for when we look to it
> for information.
>
>
>
> I can't deny the fulfillment and pleasure your volunteers experience, but
> there are also people who wish they had jobs like that.
>
>
>
> Cindy Wolff
>
>
>
>
>
> From: ARLIS/NA List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Barbara A
> Mathe
> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 6:09 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>
>
>
> Dear Marlene and ARLIS folks,
>
> Forgive me for edging this conversation in another direction but this
> discussion has hit a nerve so thanks for your patience.
>
> I understand that people want and need to be paid for their work but some
> people get satisfaction sharing information with others, even without being
> paid, assuming of course, that they can afford to do so.
>
> I had a rather bitter argument with a friend of mine who confronted me
> repeatedly with the question, "Don't you think it's wrong that the Museum
> doesn't pay its volunteers and interns?" I was telling her about the
> fantastic opportunities that have come to the people who volunteer here.
> Two, in particular, have extraordinary stories.
>
> One, as a result of his work transcribing and marking up original Darwin
> manuscripts, came to find himself in deep conversation with a number of
> British scholars at a reception at Cambridge University. I know that this
> has been a transformative experience for him and that his work has been
> invaluable to the project, which is partially grant funded. I don't know his
> financial details except that he is retired and if paid at all (for example,
> if the grant paid his expenses to continue his volunteer work for a few
> weeks at Cambridge University Library), it is certainly not a living. And I
> know he would have paid for the trip himself. You should see his smile in
> the photograph of him standing in the garden at Down House.
>
> The other is a 77 year old writer who has spent the last five years
> cataloging and scanning nearly 3,000 images taken by Carl Lumholtz in
> Northern Mexico at the end of the 19th century. Her work will make it
> possible for us to share these images with the world and particularly to
> make them available to the indigenous groups, whose forebears are pictured
> in the photographs. And our volunteer now knows more about these images than
> anyone else and will be publishing an essay in a scholarly book about the
> photographs. Perhaps she might be paid for that. I didn't ask. But if that
> small university press pays enough for that essay to compensate her
> financially for five years of work, they can expect a proposal from me
> tomorrow! I know she would certainly do it for free.
>
> Both of these individuals have made these projects major contributions of
> their lives and I was very upset by my friend's insistence asking whether or
> not it was wrong that the Museum doesn't pay our volunteers, in the context
> of these stories. I asked her if I should, on moral ground-- because we
> can't pay them-- not allow them to do the work?
>
> Another friend pointed out that I should simply have said, "but they are
> volunteers." So now I am.
>
> Wikipedia would not exist, for better and worse, but for those volunteers,
> people willing to do these things of their own volition and for their own
> reward.
>
>
>
> Barbara Mathe
> Museum Archivist and Head of Library Special Collections
> American Museum of Natural History
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________
> From: ARLIS/NA List [[log in to unmask]] on behalf of Marlene Koenig
> [[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 4:37 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>
> And this is why I do not like Wikipedia .. if you write articles for
> Wikipedia or for a journal, you should be paid for it. I am the author of
> several books and a noted expert on a subject (nothing to do with art), and
> I have written numerous articles for magazines, etc. I have also contributed
> chapters to books ... I do not do this for free.
>
> Oh, I know what Wikipedia is, and if Wikipedia needs to be taken seriously,
> Jimmy Wales needs to hire experts to write the entries ... and pay them for
> their expertise.
>
> Marlene A. Koenig
> Librarian
> WAAC - Virginia Tech
> 1001 Prince Street
> Alexandria, VA 22314
> 703-706-3039 (phone)
> 703-549-0532 (fax)
> [log in to unmask]
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ARLIS/NA List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
> [log in to unmask]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 3:39 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>
> "Wikipedia needs to hire"??
>
> Dear colleague Marlene,
>
> I think you must have misunderstood something. Wikipedia is everybody that
> contribute(s). It is me and you, if you want to improve and expand the
> articles there. It is a crowd sourcing project. Nobody can hire anybody.
> That is one of the unique things about WP. I contribute to the Norwegian
> version, both at work (from time to time ...) and right now, at 9:32 p.m.
> Norwegian time I am writing about a Norwegian painter. It is important that
> librarians contribute - in my opinion, that is.
>
> I have more than once wished that there was an editorial staff, when people
> change "my" articles, but even if there isn't, I think this is a fantastic
> project and I gladly contribute, both by donating a small amount of money
> each year, and by writing and editing articles about subjects I know
> something about - or want to learn about.
>
> All the best to my colleagues "over there"
>
> Kjersti (60, not the typical wikipedian, in other words) in Trondheim
>
> Siterer Marlene Koenig <[log in to unmask]>:
>
>> Wikipedia needs to hire and pay a staff of experts to vet and write
>> material.
>>
>>
>>
>> Marlene A. Koenig
>>
>> Librarian
>>
>> WAAC - Virginia Tech
>>
>> 1001 Prince Street
>>
>> Alexandria, VA 22314
>>
>> 703-706-3039 (phone)
>>
>> 703-549-0532 (fax)
>>
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>>
>>
>> From: ARLIS/NA List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
>> Gabrielle Reed
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 10:51 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>>
>>
>>
>> Our job as librarians is to teach our students how to evaluate
>> resources of all types. As librarians we all know the range in article
>> quality in wikipedia and it is our job to teach our students about
>> this. Wikipedia is still a wonderful tool in a very large toolkit we
>> give our students. The notion of blocking out wikipedia is truly
>> throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Keep the baby and improve the
> articles!
>>
>>
>>
>> Gabrielle V L Reed
>> Public Services Librarian
>> Morton R. Godine Library
>> Massachusetts College of Art and Design
>> 1-617-879-7102
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>> _____
>>
>> From: ARLIS/NA List [[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Lesley A
>> Bell [[log in to unmask]]
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2012 8:53 AM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>>
>> I could not disagree with you more! L
>>
>>
>>
>> Lesley A. Bell
>>
>> Visual Resources Librarian | Department of Visual Arts
>>
>> Marilyn I. Walker School of Fine and Performing Arts
>>
>> Brock University | 500 Glenridge Ave. | St. Catharines, ON L2S 3A1
>>
>> | E [log in to unmask] | T 905 688 5550 x4033 | F 905 378 5712 |
>>
>> Please consider the environment before everything else.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: ARLIS/NA List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of
>> Marlene Koenig
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2012 3:39 PM
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: [ARLIS-L] English Wikipedia anti-SOPA Blackout January 18
>>
>>
>>
>> I'd be happy if Wikipedia was blacked out permanently J
>>
>>
>>
>> Marlene A. Koenig
>>
>> Librarian
>>
>> WAAC - Virginia Tech
>>
>> 1001 Prince Street
>>
>> Alexandria, VA 22314
>>
>> 703-706-3039 (phone)
>>
>> 703-549-0532 (fax)
>>
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about
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>> maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org Questions may be addressed to list
>> owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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>> owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>
>>
>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about
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>> administrative matters (file requests, subscription requests, etc) to
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>> maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org Questions may be addressed to list
>> owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask] ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining
> ARLIS/NA see: http://www.arlisna.org/join.html Send administrative matters
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> ARLIS-L Archives and subscription maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org
> Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining
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> ARLIS-L Archives and subscription maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org
> Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining
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> ARLIS-L Archives and subscription maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org
> Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining
> ARLIS/NA see: http://www.arlisna.org/join.html Send administrative matters
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> Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Margaret English
>
>
> Librarian
> Department of Art Library
> University of Toronto
> 100 St. George St. - 6th floor
> Toronto, ON.
> M5S 3G3
>
> (416) 978-5006
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining
> ARLIS/NA see: http://www.arlisna.org/join.html Send administrative matters
> (file requests, subscription requests, etc) to [log in to unmask]
> ARLIS-L Archives and subscription maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org
> Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining
> ARLIS/NA see: http://www.arlisna.org/join.html Send administrative matters
> (file requests, subscription requests, etc) to [log in to unmask]
> ARLIS-L Archives and subscription maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org
> Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Margaret English
>
>
> Librarian
> Department of Art Library
> University of Toronto
> 100 St. George St. - 6th floor
> Toronto, ON.
> M5S 3G3
>
> (416) 978-5006
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about
> joining ARLIS/NA see: http://www.arlisna.org/join.html Send
> administrative matters (file requests, subscription requests, etc)
> to [log in to unmask] ARLIS-L Archives and subscription
> maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org Questions may be addressed to
> list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mail submissions to [log in to unmask] For information about joining ARLIS/NA see: http://www.arlisna.org/join.html Send administrative matters (file requests, subscription requests, etc) to [log in to unmask] ARLIS-L Archives and subscription maintenance: http://lsv.arlisna.org Questions may be addressed to list owner (Judy Dyki) at: [log in to unmask]
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
|